Do You Believe in God?

[Leon]

Hi.

OK, this is totally irrelevant to translating, but I am very interested in religion, spirituality, and the idea of (a) god(s) and how the world began/was created.

I would just like to know which of the following theistic stati suits you best and why you choose this stance:

THEIST
Monotheist; polytheist; deist

AGNOSTIC
Strong agnostic; weak agnostic; apathetic agnostic; ignostic

ATHEIST
Strong atheist; weak atheist; nontheist

Thanks.

Leon.

[spiros]

I would say something which is not in your list: not religious but spiritual. In fact, I can create a poll for you.

If I were to choose a religion I would say that Buddhism comes closer (although I do not perceive it as religion) with its emphasis in not harming sentient beings, its advanced system of meditation practice and its non-theistic and non-dogmatic approach.

[Leon]

Yeah, I too am very interested in Buddhism, and do not perceive it as a religion. It's odd, seeing as atheists can be Buddhists, in which case, I don't see its goal on the whole?

So are you an atheist? Do you believe that there is a deity of any sort?

Leon.

[spiros]

    God is a concept
    By which we measure
    Our pain
    I'll say it again
    God is a concept
    By which we measure
    Our pain

    I don't believe in magic
    I don't believe in I-ching
    I don't believe in Bible
    I don't believe in tarot
    I don't believe in Hitler
    I don't believe in Jesus
    I don't believe in Kennedy
    I don't believe in Buddha
    I don't believe in Mantra
    I don't believe in Gita
    I don't believe in Yoga
    I don't believe in kings
    I don't believe in Elvis
    I don't believe in Zimmerman
    I don't believe in Beatles
    I just believe in me
    Yoko and me
    And that's reality

    The dream is over
    What can I say?
    The dream is over
    Yesterday
    I was the Dreamweaver
    But now I'm reborn
    I was the Walrus
    But now I'm John
    And so dear friends
    You'll just have to carry on
    The dream is over

[Leon]

Well, that didn't really help...

[spiros]

I am sorry. I can only approach metaphysics and any theistic-related discussion with a sense of humour. So much blood has been shed on this earth on the name of various Gods that honestly, I am not in the mood for any serious discussion.

[Elias71]

Honestly, I don't want to vote on the poll because I don't understand the differences in the choices enough to be able to identify which I would belong too (reading the wikipedia articles didn't help much either). Let me explain my views and maybe you can decide...

I believe in a God. I often feel that there is someone out there guiding me, and giving me the strength I need sometimes to go through the problems I face in life. I believe that there is someone out there that we can put our faith in, and rely on. Sometimes things in life go bad, but that doesn't mean that "there is no God" since there is one thing I have learned in my short life so far, no matter how bad an experience is, you ALWAYS gain something from it. I have gone through years, not just days, where there had been something that has bugging me (too many to list), things that still bug me to this day about myself, others, and the world around me. But eventually, I get over these things, and I become a better person for fighting it out and not giving up and turning a blind eye.

Do I believe in the church however? Not a chance that I ever will. The orthodox church has done too much in my eyes to damage the world (especially the culture and namely the history of Greece, something which I am practically in love with and can't stop thinking and reading about), and after learning the truth, I have become outraged that I ever was a follower of it. This doesn't even apply to just the orthodox church, but all churches in general, and for all religions (Christianity, Islam, Judaism, etc.).

Do I believe in what Christianity says is true? Nope. Do I believe in the words of the bible? Nope. But do I agree with what religion as a whole has to teach? I do. I do agree with the values it teaches (being nice to others, being faithful to your peers, striving to be the best person that you can possibly be...) but it is the way in which religion has abused the people all over the world that has me angry. The things these religions preach look good on the outside, and often times are good rules to live by, but the church itself rarely represents these lessons in life itself.

So basically, I do not believe in Christianity or any other religion, I am not an atheist as I believe there is a god, but I am not an agnostic because I do know that the concept of a god, be it a person, a spirit, or a piece of ourselves, does exist, and I feel his presence in my life every day.

[metafrastis]

Νο.

[spiros]

Πάντως εάν κρίνω από τα μέχρι τώρα αποτελέσματα, εμπνέομαι για το επόμενο σάιτ... atheist.gr ή atheist-translators.com!

[Leon]

Elias71, you have made some very good points. I do also, however, believe that you could pay your respects to God through the Christian Greek Orthodox Church without having to associate yourself with people whom you think or suspect are changing things to damage other people, as you say. Although I would love to know, who has damaged Greek history and how? Why don't you agree with the 'Christian God'?

Personally, I self-identify as a weak agnostic (unsure of God's existence but I am not saying that it is totally unknowable (contrary to what strong agnostics believe)) and am surprised at the amount of atheists in the poll! It's not very often I come across a Greek atheist (by your tune, spiros, I am guessing that you are one too. Apologies if I am incorrect and have offended you, though).

It is, however, far, far much easier to prove that something does exist than that it doesn't. I think you can prove that God exists, but not that He doesn't (catch my drift?). The one thing that is really holding me back from delving into the Truth is why are there so many different religions saying different things? Which is the 'correct' religion? If any could answer that, I'd be extremely grateful. Wasn't Christ a Jew? Yet Christians (especially what the Πάτερ from the Orthodox Church at my Greek school told me) claim that their religion is the 'original', yet it broke off due to disagreements (presumably on things such as the Holy Trinity) and other 'subreligions' were formed, and their Bibles have been changed according to what they want to put, but the Greek Orthodox Bible is how it was originally written...

Leon.

[Elias71]

Leon, for starters, the foundation of Christianity was built on the destruction of all that was Greek. The early "Byzantine" (I  consider them Romans, because thats what they were) emperors such as Theodosius destroyed all things Greek that they could, and that is why they are now even considered "the Great". Why are we even considering him great? Because he ran around destroying GREEK temples along with the other emperors who did everything they could to supress the Greek beliefs and lifestyle by FORCING Christianity upon them?

Not only that, the introduction of Christianity into Greece was the Romans' way of finally conquering the Greeks as a people. Yes, they had won militarily, but before the introduction of Christianity, Greece was still the cultural center that it always was. Greeks were educating the Roman upper class, and many of the Roman philosophers even stated (several times) in their writings that they envied the complexity of the Greek language and considered it superior to Latin. The Romans knew that they had not conquered Greece in any way culturally or spiritually as the Greek spirit went on unchanged.

So what were the Romans to do? Could they afford to have one of their "subjects" still be superior to them in all things cultural? Of course not, that would disturb the balance of their empire. So what did they do? They try to take away the one things the Greeks still had... culture. By making us buy Christianity through violence of course (fooling us into thinking that we were in charge, and that it was all a happy little thing). They now had legitimate claim to run around and destroy everything Greek... since now Greek was "pagan", and that is exactly what they did. The Olympics were killed off, the 12 Gods were now a joke to be told only in stories. Much of the philosophy was deemed unacceptable as it blatantly went against the word of the Bible, and Greece just entered another dark age.

Christianity, in my eyes, is nothing but an anti-Hellenic tool of propaganda, that too many of us have accepted and blinded ourselves with. Anyways, I'm tired now and I'm probably rambling like an idiot. So if I didn't make sense, I'll try to explain again tomorrow. :)

Btw, if I offended anybody, sorry. But these are my views, and these are what I believe in. Feel free to think of me any way you wish, you have that right. :)

[Leon]

Hi, and thanks for all that information! Very useful, and I have passed it on to an English-Cypriot friend of mine who rants and raves about how wonderful Christianity is.

Leon.

[Elias71]

This should be interesting... Let me know what he has to say. :P

[ruadisneyfan]

Let me just give some "food for thought"....as well as my own personal experience:

Sometimes, people just need to have a personal experience for themselves...as I have. Let me first say that I have been a Christian for many,many years...I have been a Christian since I was 12. I am now 37. When I was 24 I was diagnosed with my first brain tumor. In a 4 year span between 1994-1997 I had a total of 7 surgeries, radiation, and to many stays in the hospital to count. To say the least, I was in bad shape. Bed-ridden 95% of the time....I had been prayed on by people in my church several times....but I believe God works/moves in His time, not ours. As I was sitting in my seat one night at church in 1998, alone....no one touching me, all of a sudden, the only way I can describe it is a feeling of electricity going through my body. Every hair on me stood up. I have never felt anything like it before or since. Not ever. In an instant, my constant, crippling, life altering pain was gone. A peace like I have never felt before came over me. It is now 2006....I have not been in the hospital since that day.... No surgeries, illnesses (not counting colds,etc.) nothing!!  I am now completely healthy. Yes, I not only believe in God but, I believe in the power of prayer. I am living, breathing,testifying proof. Don't ask me why some people are healed and not others...THAT I do not have an answer for. I am not God. But I know what He did on my behalf. That is my personal experience and testimony.
 I am not trying to say my beliefs are better than anyone elses....or that what I believe should determine how someelse feels. I am just giving my personal experience and testimony. I am not just a believer by faith...but I have had a personal experience with the miraculous. And once you have had a personal experience like that...it is something you never, ever can forget. For those who have not had a personal experience....that is why the Bible says.... faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things NOT SEEN. (Hebrews 11:1)

[Leon]

That's really odd, but a very happy experience for you, I imagine. But I have the feeling that only people who are baptised and follow God and are strictly without sin are helped by God (if there is such a thing). That's how I see it.

Leon.