probouleutic → προβουλευτικός

spiros

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billberg23

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Ancient or modern?  Unattested in TLG (and even in Heraeus! (-:)
« Last Edit: 04 Apr, 2021, 04:45:26 by billberg23 »



spiros

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I was wondering whether it was based on a ancient word:

probouleutic (not comparable)
Relating to the Ancient Greek council, which held preliminary discussions before submitting matters to the general assembly.
(Britain, by extension) Pertaining to preliminary discussion before discussion in council, parliament, or other public debate.
probouleutic - Wiktionary


billberg23

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spiros

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διττοῦ δὲ ὄντος τοῦ ἡμετέρου νοῦ, ἡ μὲν πρὸ  τῶν ἔργων βουλὴ καὶ τὸ προβουλευτικὸν καὶ ὥσπερ λεπτότερον καὶ ἔνθεον λέγεται Προμηθεύς, τὸ δὲ μετὰ τὸ κακῶς ἀποβῆναι τὰ πράγματα, μετὰ τὸ καταβεβηκέναι, ὡς πρὸς τὸ παχύτερόν τε καὶ χαλαρώτερον ὄνομα τὸ Ἐπιμηθεὺς ἐκληρώσατο.

Scholia In Hesiodum, Scholia in theogoniam (scholia vetera) (5025: 003) “Scholia vetera in Hesiodi theogoniam”, Ed. di Gregorio, L. Milan: Società Editrice Vita e Pensiero, 1975. Verse 565, line 12

ἐπεὶ δὲ προμηθέστεροι γεγονότες καὶ προβουλευτικώτεροι τὸ πῦρ ἐφεῦρον, καὶ θερμοτέρων, ἤγουν πανουργοτέρων, πραγμάτων ὠρέχθησαν καὶ τὴν τοῦ ἀπερίττου καὶ ἐλευθέρου βίου μετέστρεψαν διαγωγὴν καὶ εἱμαρμένην, δι' ὧν ὁ κόσμος κοσμεῖται καὶ τὰ ἡδέα ἡμῖν καὶ τερπνὰ καὶ ἁβρότατα γίνεται δίκην γυναικὸς ἡμᾶς καταθέλγοντα καὶ τρυφερωτέρους ἀπεργαζόμενα, ὃ καλεῖ πλάσιν γυναικὸς ὁ ποιητής.

Democritus Phil., Fragmenta (1304: 002) “Die Fragmente der Vorsokratiker, vol. 2, 6th edn.”, Ed. Diels, H., Kranz, W. Berlin: Weidmann, 1952, Repr. 1966. Fragment 5, line 130

τὰ δὲ ἦν αἱ  συμφωνίαι καὶ τὰ ὁρκωμοτήρια, ὅσα γε τοῖς Σχολαρίοις, αἰτίοις ὑπάρξασι τῆς ἡγεμονίας αὐτῷ καὶ δύναμιν τῶν ἄλλων συγκλητικῶν κεκτημένοις μείζω καὶ ἡγεμονικὴν, συνέθετο· σχῆμα μὲν  αὐτὸς διασώζειν ἡγεμονίας· τῶν δ' ὅσα πράσσεσθαι μέλλοι πάντων εἶναι προβουλευτὰς καὶ διανομέας σφᾶς, καὶ ῥητῶν καὶ ἀποῤῥήτων ἐπιγνώμονας καὶ βεβαιωτάς.

Nicephorus Gregoras Hist., Historia Romana (4145: 001) “Nicephori Gregorae historiae Byzantinae, 3 vols.”, Ed. Schopen, L., Bekker, I. Bonn: Weber, 1:1829; 2:1830; 3:1855; Corpus scriptorum historiae Byzantinae. Volume 2, page 682, line 19

ἀπροβούλευτος - Ancient Greek (LSJ)

Alla Boulé spettava l'iniziativa legislativa: secondo la norma stabilita da Clistene e mai modificata in tutta la storia greca, l'assemblea generale della popolazione non poteva discutere nessun argomento su cui la Boulé non avesse predisposto un decreto, secondo la norma detta μὴ προβουλευτικόν: ogni legge votata dall'assemblea generale doveva necessariamente esser stata preceduta da un probouleuma, un decreto emanato dalla Boulé, che, in regime democratico, l'assemblea generale aveva la piena facoltà di accogliere, modificare in tutto o in parte o rigettare.
Boulé - Wikipedia
« Last Edit: 06 Apr, 2021, 13:53:29 by spiros »


billberg23

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Oops!  So τὸ προβουλευτικόν is definitely there in the medieval Hesiod-scholia by Tzetzes (12th cent.), which we think reflected the Democritean Διάκοσμος ("Cosmic Order").  And if the comparative  προβουλευτικώτερος was in use in Tzetzes' time, then surely the positive form of that adjective (προβουλευτικός) was also known. That doesn't mean, of course, that Democritus himself (5th cent. BCE) knew or used the word.  But if we don't consider 12th century too late for "ancient Greek," we should probably put προβουλευτικός back on the AG-Eng board, and I'll bite my tongue for suggesting it belonged elsewhere.  (-:   


 

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