Author Topic: ὦ καλὴ Κορίνθια -> O beautiful Corinthian (inscription found on a water fountain)  (Read 2634 times)

trkyem

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Can you please translate these ancient greek inscriptions into english?


Here are two closer photos of the inscriptions.





The inscription on the right side of the fountain has a tablet carved over it while the one on the left has a mirror carved over it.Do you think this has anything to do with what is written under it?Here are two closer looks of them.




Thank you.
« Last Edit: 10 Jul, 2009, 17:18:33 by billberg23 »


trkyem

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Re: ancient greek inscription found on a water fountain
« Reply #1 on: 04 Jul, 2009, 02:49:42 »
These pictures are larger in size.Maybe this way it will be easier to read.I've tried online translations to be able to read these but nothing worked.I will be very grateful if someone can help me.This fountain is right next to a fortress and the history of this fortress is quite a mystery so I'm hoping that these inscriptions maybe some help in figuring out the history of the fortress.




billberg23

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Re: ancient greek inscription found on a water fountain
« Reply #2 on: 04 Jul, 2009, 07:44:20 »
Α tentative reading:
              Ι

Μάρκος Τ. ἀδελφός καὶ        Markos, brother (of Titus?) and
[τρό]φιμος σο..υνε                  trophimos, [  ]
… σοὶ τόνδε τύμ-                 for you this tomb,
βον, ὦ καλὴ Κορίνθια,          O beautiful Corinthian woman,
Α Δ·Ι·Νον. ἐτεύξαν .            [date?] built
μόρῳ μνήμης [χάρ-]            as a monument to your fate.
ιν

                         ΙΙ
                        
μόνους ἰδού                         Behold, only
εἰκοσι Σ. μία                         twenty-one (?)
κύκλους ἐν                           revolutions (= years) in
Ἄιδι σκε…                            Hades [
-θε τὴν κ[αλὴν]                    ] the beautiful
Κορίνθ[ιαν]                          Corinthian woman.

We hope that someone with a better epigraphical sense can elucidate the details.  Clearly, however, the edifice was originally a tomb of the late Roman period.  The inscriptions commemorate the premature death of a woman of Corinth.  I'm not sure of the significance for her of the mirror and tablet.  Beauty and literacy?  Or could the "mirror" be actually the sistrum of Isis?
Excellent photos, Trkyem!  Where exactly is the tomb located?
« Last Edit: 28 Nov, 2011, 07:23:15 by billberg23 »
Τί δέ τις; Τί δ' οὔ τις; Σκιᾶς ὄναρ ἄνθρωπος. — Πίνδαρος


vbd.

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Re: ancient greek inscription found on a water fountain
« Reply #3 on: 04 Jul, 2009, 08:54:45 »
I think it's pretty safe to read "ΤΡΟΦΙΜΟΣ" at the beginning of line 2 of the first inscription. ἀδελφός καί τρόφιμος makes perfect sense.

Agree on the rest!
At last, I have peace.

billberg23

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Tρόφιμος is brilliant, Alex!  So would Markos be both brother and nurseling, or is the τρόφιμος a different person?  I'm wondering if Markos is actually the brother of the Corinthian woman.

In New Comedy, τρόφιμος usually meant "young master" rather than "nurseling."  Could the Corinthian woman have been a slave?   I notice that she isn't named, at least not in the parts we can read ...
Τί δέ τις; Τί δ' οὔ τις; Σκιᾶς ὄναρ ἄνθρωπος. — Πίνδαρος

vbd.

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All good questions. I think the 2nd part of the line leaves room for a name of the trofimos, whatever that may be. That said, Markos being both the adelfos and the trofimos makes well sense.

About her being a slave:
My guess is that she isn't one. That's just a guess; I'm open to be persuaded otherwise. That said, I'd expect it to be explicitly stated, if indeed she was a slave.
At last, I have peace.


trkyem

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Re: ancient greek inscription found on a water fountain
« Reply #6 on: 04 Jul, 2009, 15:21:18 »
Thank you so much for the translation. It's located in Eğrigöz village in the Kütahya province of Turkey. Here it is on the map.




I asked the local people there what they knew about the tomb and they told me that there used to be the picture of a woman covered in ancient greek writing on the tomb.If you look closely you can see the shape of a human in between the two inscriptions.But since that image got damaged along with the writings on it I guess that's all we can learn about the tomb.But right across the tomb there was a historical house and I found another inscription there in it's front yard.Maybe this one is related to the tomb in some way.Can you translate this one too please.It's more damaged than the other one but I hope it can be read.

Here it is:


Thank you and great site by the way.
« Last Edit: 04 Jul, 2009, 15:25:04 by wings »

billberg23

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After a quick look at your latest inscription, I can report that it's probably not at all related to the others.  The letter forms indicate a much earlier date in the Hellenistic period.

In addition, I need to point out that the inscription far exceeds the 12-word limit stipulated in "The Rules" (button at top of page).  True, we got a bit carried away by the beautiful Corinthian woman!  But this one is excessive.  However, when we have time, we may be able to give you a rough idea as to what it's about.  If you really need a translation, you can always make arrangements by posting in the "Post a Translation Job!" section of this Forum.
« Last Edit: 06 Jul, 2009, 19:35:07 by billberg23 »
Τί δέ τις; Τί δ' οὔ τις; Σκιᾶς ὄναρ ἄνθρωπος. — Πίνδαρος

billberg23

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Actually, Trkyem, I can read very little on that last stone, which is extremely worn.  Maybe someone else can do better.  It does appear to be an honorific (euergetic) inscription from the late first cent. BCE to the early first cent. CE.  I can make out the title "Octavius Augustus" in the genitive in lines 1-2, and "his/her/their own money" in lines 3-4, also in the genitive.
  
About her being a slave:
My guess is that she isn't one. That's just a guess; I'm open to be persuaded otherwise. That said, I'd expect it to be explicitly stated, if indeed she was a slave.
You're probably right, Alex.  I was just remembering that Corinth, as a thriving seaport, did a notorious business in "beautiful women."
« Last Edit: 04 Jul, 2009, 19:19:52 by billberg23 »
Τί δέ τις; Τί δ' οὔ τις; Σκιᾶς ὄναρ ἄνθρωπος. — Πίνδαρος

trkyem

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Actually, Trkyem, I can read very little on that last stone, which is extremely worn.  Maybe someone else can do better.  It does appear to be an honorific (euergetic) inscription from the late first cent. BCE to the early first cent. CE.  I can make out the title "Octavius Augustus" in the genitive in lines 1-2, and "his/her/their own money" in lines 3-4, also in the genitive.
  You're probably right, Alex.  I was just remembering that Corinth, as a thriving seaport, did a notorious business in "beautiful women."

Thank you very much for your help I hope I'll get the translation somehow.

trkyem

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Re: ancient greek inscription found on a water fountain
« Reply #10 on: 28 Nov, 2011, 00:08:15 »

 Clearly, however, the edifice was originally a tomb of the late Roman period.

This post is old now, but if it's possible I would like to ask you a question. I've searched a lot, but couldn't find an answer. You're very knowledgeable, so maybe you have an answer. How could a tomb been turned into a fountain? Does this mean there is a dead body inside the fountain?

Thank you.


billberg23

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Haha!  No, trkyem, the body's long gone.  The sarcophagus (or, more likely, urn) was probably removed centuries before the structure was adapted to its later use as a fountain — probably in the Ottoman period?
Τί δέ τις; Τί δ' οὔ τις; Σκιᾶς ὄναρ ἄνθρωπος. — Πίνδαρος

trkyem

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Yes, there are Ottoman inscriptions on it, but what do you think the reason of the removal of the sarcophagus is? Theft maybe?

billberg23

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It might help to know something of the history of that region during the Middle Ages and early modern period.  Was it subject to destructive invasions?  Or were the monuments of its long-forgotten cemeteries simply pillaged for building materials?  Over the centuries, towns are burned, buried, wantonly destroyed or radically transformed in the wake of all sorts of upheavals.  Then archaeologists like yourself, my friend, are left to puzzle it all out ...
But thank you again for resurrecting our beautiful Corinthian woman!
Τί δέ τις; Τί δ' οὔ τις; Σκιᾶς ὄναρ ἄνθρωπος. — Πίνδαρος

trkyem

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Thanks again for sharing your knowledge:)